Board Thread:General Discussion/@comment-31398341-20170409101440/@comment-31221741-20171024130858

Allofyou wrote: Robepriority wrote: A lot of these top ranks are clausebreakers, but that's why their up there in the first place.

I would also rank some of them lower due to sheer usage - not much you can do against shadowtag gengar, but most people expect an ash-gren on a majority of teams, and bring fairy/electric/grass coverage moves - along w retracting kill bait

Garchomp and Tyranitar aren't high because of rocksetting but rather their high stats, giving them a good chance to boost and have the enemy team helpless unless a sespific counter is used.

I don't see cinccino ranked, despite being a common pokemon. Nice reply!

For clausebreaker ones, I am actually against it (such as Minimize and SleepTrap M-Gengar). Although I personally don't use those things, I can see that it is ranked high bc of lack of tiers currently.

I did not list Garchomp as a rock setter bc it is unreleased. Garchomp actually has many checks (revenge killers, especially ice shard users), but its only real counter is Togekiss (immune to both STAB moves and doesn't care much about Rock Slide due to high defense). As you said, its main selling point is high overall stats, especially physical attack. It can outspeed most of the PBB meta as well.

For Tyranitar, I listed both offensive and rock setter set. Rock setting is in fact one of its selling point too. Mostly bc of its typing and attack power, which can forces switch often. Its special defense is also insane due to sandstorm, surviving a lot of super effective special hits. Therefore giving it free chance to set rocks up.

Ash greninja is actually only good when having Timid nature, which is not common for sure (due to the cost and unbreedability). After it became Ash gren its speed and both attacks are very high, making it a good checks to many pokemon. It can beat grass types too due to high power Ice Beam. Agree with you on lowering the rank on this one though. While it can check many pokemon, it is very frail and usually be KOed back if it can't KO the opponent first. Coverage moves are problem too. (Ash greninja From B+ to B)

​​Cinccino should still be ranked. With skill link, it is surprisingly powerful with STAB tail slap. In fact, it can revenge kill pokemon like Tyranitar (w/ Bullet Seed) and Garchomp. Its status moves usable is not just Sing, but also Thunder Wave to save the day without gambling too much. In the chat box people usually overrate HA cinccino, but it is still usable with good nature / moveset. It is really stopped by ANY steel types though. That's why it is not ranked higher than B-.

Gonna move Excadrill down due to Iron Head (another main STAB) unreleased and Cloyster down due to it offering almost zero defensive contributions to the team. What do you think about this?

Cloyster A >>> A-

Excadrill A- >>> B+

Thanks for the idea!

I APROOVE!!!!!!!!!!!!!