Board Thread:General Discussion/@comment-31398341-20170409101440/@comment-31398341-20170422140241

Jinx666 wrote: Grass types have manhy weaknesses, and as long as you can get grass types outta the picture, then quagsire is free

Donphan is much tankier than tentacruel, as well as having Sturdy, to make sure that at least one entry hazard is out

Donphan also has much higher attack, and priority, and the better way of spinning against Galvantula, probably the most common hazard setter of sticky web.

Tentacruel is the best spinner against special attackers, while Donphan is more physical., id rate them rather equal like you have done

Im now also bringing in discussion about Roserade

Roserade is firstly a very powerful special attacker, being able to 2HKO milotic and florges without additional defense buffs, as well as survive an ice beam from most pokemon that can learn it due to its also high special defense

it can be fairly fast at max, outspeeding pokes like Togekiss and gardevoir, as well as OHKO them with a sludge bomb

Other moves include Toxic for tanks, spikes for setting up, Coverage such as shadow ball to OHKO Gengars etc.

Once you can get Hidden power, HP Fire + Technician Roserade will be able to deal with steel types, which are roserades main problem, so for now, i would put her at C+, along with the other good special attackers such as sylveon and mega manetric I fully agree on Roserade, a good special wall with usable special attack and speed while also capable of using both Spikes and Toxic Spikes. While Greninja can use both of these, Roserade has an edge on special defense and sometimes typing.

For Quagsire, as you said, it would be very strong after grass types are gone. However, there are some pokes carrying grass type coverage, such as Solar Beam on MChar-Y and Grass Knot on Greninja. Gengar and Alakazam may also carry Energy Ball as well. Needing support for the team is what makes it not ranked higher than B. Not a horrible rank though.

Both Donphan and Tentacruel are both niche pokemon, but Tentacruel can also set up Toxic Spikes and beat Calm Mind users. Donphan does not necessarily beat Galvantula though as it often carry Energy Ball. Typing also hinders it from being as good as Tentacruel in general.

Roserade : Unranked >>> C+